Monday, November 20, 2006

Collectively even

* simon:
"To explain it from my perspective, from '88 to '91 I was a technician trainer in the Royal Saudi Air Force, instructing on a brand new Panavia Tornado squadron. I was there, ostensibly, as well as looking after the planes, to teach young Saudi lads what we called 'technical aeroplane english'. That is about 700 words of mechanical language. In reality they (the smart ones) spoke well in English, and all, to a man, hated America. They told us all about that, in fact sometimes they wouldn't talk about anything else. Why? For the robbery and for the hypocricy that they all felt.

They saw it coming, they wanted it to happen, indeed some of them would have given their own souls for that that happened. A few of us (Englishmen) who were there at the time saw that day coming too because we saw it in them (the Americans that were there were far too brash, they never saw anything, coming or going, at them or not).

Do not ever believe that Saudi men did not fly planes into the World Trade Center Towers. They did. Collectively even, they gave me (personal) advance notice. When it happened I wasn't surprised. I knew who did it. Before they even said the word 'Osama' on the TV. Shock? Yes. IF America doesn't change its tune, there might be a few more shocks to come. They told me that too."


Simon said...

Whilst I was there I lived in Al Khobar. This happened long after I left. You can't see the windows in the pictures because they were all broken in the bombing. But during GWI we all used masking tape on windows to protect against flying glass fragments in the event of a nearby Scud hit (in fact wreckage from one did supposedly hit that actual building). Some bright wags who were stationed there decided to mask that one out using the Star of David as a template. It didn't go down well with the locals. Not one bit. They actually called the area, which had been built to contain local nomadic Bedouin, who nevertheless didn't want to settle, 'Little Israel'. Any small wonder it became the focus for anti-American feelings of the very highest order?

Simon said...

N.B. Just found a reference to the above. Possibly from the opposite perspective though:

There is one powerful image that will remain with me forever and which ultimately changed - or rather, restored - my life. Nearly every window in every building we were in was taped up to keep it from shattering from explosions. Three tapes were placed on each window, two in the shape of an "X" and one horizontally. You'll have to draw a sketch of this to visualize what I'm saying, however at the confluence of these strips of tape, there appeared a six-pointed Star of David. The image had a different meaning to me in 1991, it meant that as usual, whenever and wherever the Armed Forces of the United States meets an enemy, there are included in their ranks a large number of people of the Jewish faith. I had a lot of hate in me then and I enjoyed the thought that, according to Jewish War Veterans estimates, myself and some five thousand people of Jewish background were urinating and defecating on that country daily. Today, the image of those Stars of David in every Saudi Arabian window has a completely different meaning. Freed now from the bondage of mindless hate, I see it as proof ancient teachings of my religion, that though I felt abandoned and alone in a "G-d forsaken" place, no place on Earth is G-d forsaken - and no person, least of all myself, is abandoned by H-shem. That image was one of the sparks that kindled the religious rebirth I experienced in the years since the Gulf War that helped me return to a happy and fulfilling life. Now in 1998, I finally feel that I've returned home. But it was a long trip back.


Kathleen said...

Simon, I believe you. In fact, I've read reports that the 9/11 highjackers entered our country through our own Embassy in Riyadh. Nuff said.

Simon said...


Nuff said.

Well, almost (being as I'm on a roll now). In the earlier unicorn thread you said:

Surely, if we were going to fight the terrorists where they live, Riyadh is where we should have used force, not Baghdad.

If an entire nation should suffer and be bombed for the actions of its individual citizens, then yes, you are right. In reality Iraq was bombed for the supposed actions of its leadership, even when there was no connection between Iraq and 9-11. A funny old world then. I don't think the people who took those planes even thought of themselves as 'terrorists'. They set out to avenged the wrongs that they perceived had been committed against their country and their countyfolk. They believed the USA had stolen their nation's resources for many many years. Not that they hadn't been paid for it in some part in some way, but that in fact some of their own had been subverted by the 'other' side into accepting far less than it was truly worth, and even then not entirely for the general good. They saw that their own nation had not benefited in real terms, sure major construction projects had taken place, but this had been mostly to the advantage of multinational (and very very often America based) corporations. They saw that their own poor had become poorer than ever before, and that there was no end in sight to it all. To add to this, their own ideas about their own versions of democracy had become completely stiffled in the process.

To put it another way, they had found a unwelcome burglar in their house. Not that the burglar had come, taken, and then gone away with their possessions, they found he was still there living amongst them. He was getting fat off the back of something that wasn't his to begin with, and he was still refusing to leave. Indeed he was entrenching his position, armed and guarded against all reproach. That's what pissed them off most of all. They didn't hate American freedoms in America. They hated American freedoms in Saudi Arabia, which ran completely contrary to the idea of their own chosen world of freedom.

lukery said...

thnx simon.
If an entire nation should suffer and be bombed for the *actions of its individual citizens*, then yes, you are right. In reality Iraq was bombed for the supposed actions of its leadership, even when there was no connection between Iraq and 9-11.

i had the same problem with the war on afghanistan. apparently obl and his 19 friends committed a crime, and a war was launched.

Kathleen said...

Simon, I don't believe anyone should be bombed for any reason. I was just pointing out the fallacy of Dopey's reasoning, you should pardon the expression.

I don't believe in responding in kind to harm. It only drags everyone down to a very beastial level. While it's a "natural" reaction to instinctively strike back, resisting that urge and rising above it, is what it takes to prevent being dragged down to the level of intending another harm. Not easy, but necessary.

The I Ching advises us not to fight evil, but rather to nourish the good. Besdies, how can one tell when we are faced with evil or just projecting our own inner motives on to another? Better to nourish the good.